ACTU boss Sally McManus has been repeatedly pressed to reveal what she knew and when about alleged criminal behaviour at the CFMEU in a heated ABC television exchange.
Following reports of bikers acting as shop stewards, including one who earned $250,000 a year as a health and safety officer, Ms McManus told 7.30 presenter Sarah Ferguson she had “heard rumours” about the CFMEU’s relationship with bikers.
Before the reports aired over the weekend, controversial CFMEU boss John Setka resigned from the position of union secretary he had held for 12 years.
When a photograph of Ms McManus smiling alongside Mr Setka and his then wife Emma Walters resurfaced, the secretary of the Australian Council of Trade Unions said she was not aware of any alleged criminal conduct at the CFMEU.
“I had heard rumors out there, but after the 60 Minutes show, it was completely out in the open what was going on,” he said Tuesday night.
“And once you know that organized crime is really within a syndicate, you have to take steps to do everything you can to get rid of it.”
Ferguson pressed her on what she did when she heard those “rumors about organized crime involvement in the CFMEU’s construction division.”
But Ms McManus rejected that categorisation, saying she had “never heard any rumours that organised crime was involved”.
ACTU director Sally McManus is pictured with CFMEU’s John Setka and his then wife Emma Walters.
“There were posts on Facebook from people who were supposedly bikers or used to be bikers.”
Ms McManus said she raised those issues with the “relevant leaders” of the CFMEU at the time and “made it very clear that there is no place for this in our trade union movement”.
However, this did not satisfy the tenacious Ferguson, who persisted with her tough line of questioning.
“Did you do anything other than mention the existence of Facebook pages? Did you report them to the police or other authorities?” he asked.
“There was no allegation of wrongdoing at the time. The allegations of wrongdoing came to light on Sunday evening,” Ms McManus said.
Ferguson hit back again, in even stronger terms.
‘Are you saying that in the reports you heard and the actions you took, no further details were provided to you or (CFMEU national secretary Zach) Smith about the involvement of motorcycle gang members or associates in CFMEU activities?’
Ms. McManus said: “I was not given any information about that before the allegations aired on (60 Minutes).”
But the 7.30 presenter was not to be deterred, asking whether the ACTU boss had “been ignoring allegations made against the CFMEU because he was afraid of the union’s power and influence”.
“Absolutely not,” McManus said angrily. “Here I am saying we will stand up to organized crime.”
When Ferguson pressed further, Ms McManus said: “I’ve given you those answers,” adding: “Sarah, you might be surprised (but) I don’t know much about motorcycle gangs…”
“It’s not my area of expertise. When people have pointed out to me a Facebook post that featured a photo of someone who was supposedly related to this or that, I’ve immediately talked to people about it. I myself didn’t know if that was true.”
There were mixed responses online to Ferguson’s dogged pursuit of the story, as he repeatedly rephrased the same question.
“Sarah Ferguson has proven she is a real journalist. We wouldn’t be having this conversation if she had criticised Dutton, would we?” one person wrote on X.
ABC’s Sarah Ferguson (pictured) was tenacious in her interview with ACTU’s Sally McManus on Tuesday night.
CFMEU boss John Setka (pictured) resigned from his post on Friday evening.
Another wrote that “Sarah Ferguson is a treasure… Whatever the political context, we must hold our parties and organisations accountable for their wrongdoings.”
But some thought the ABC host was too strident and went too far.
“It was a disaster for Sarah Ferguson, but not for Sally McManus,” one person wrote.
Another wrote that Ferguson “persisted in pushing unsubstantiated claims.”
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